Transcript of joint doorstop interview of Minister for Foreign Affairs George Yeo and Minister of Foreign and European Affairs of the French Republic, Bernard Kouchner on 29 October at 7.50pm

Minister: Just let me say how delighted I am to welcome an old friend, Bernard Kouchner, to the Ministry. He's no stranger to Singapore, to Southeast Asia. He's done a lot of good work here. He's a man with a big heart, dealing with the refugees from Vietnam after 1975. He was absolutely indefatigable.

Kouchner: (laughs)...I'm tired now...

Minister: But now we meet him in his new incarnation as Foreign Minister, and we just had a good review of bilateral relations- they're excellent. We spent more of our time discussing Myanmar and I explained to Minister Kouchner the difficulty of the situation and the importance of rallying around UN Special Envoy Ibrahim Gambari. I myself have just come back from China and Japan and I believe our positions are quite well-aligned. I asked for European support, for French support, and I was very happy to receive a very positive response from Minister Kouchner. Of course, Europe has its own values, and must take a strong position consonant with its own value system. We respect that. But I believe we can work together to strengthen Gambari's hand so that he can do the catalytic work of helping to bring about national reconciliation in Myanmar. It has to be a genuine dialogue; it can't just be for show and it must be something which will achieve results. And on this, Minister Kouchner and I were in complete agreement. Over to you, sir.

Kouchner: Thank you. Well, the Minister is too good to me. Thank you George, thank you so much. We have an excellent, as the Minister told you, personal relationship, and we are in agreement on the line, yes, on Burma, we must support and give our best ideas and be with Ibrahim Gambari. Of course, yes. And at the same time, George and I, we must work to 'feed' his programme. He is in charge as Chairman of ASEAN countries. This is so important for us. We are so far, the European Union (from ASEAN). Of course we have to be close to them, support these ideas, and to support the UN Special Envoy Ibrahim Gambari. But we also have to think about new ideas to offer to Mr Gambari and we'll do it because this is not our first contact. We used to phone to each other and certainly we'll be together in offering new perspectives to the Burmese people. I know the difficulties. I know the very complicated situation in Burma, Myanmar. Yes I know. But it is not a reason, because the people reacted to the images in the TV. And we all reacted, we were together, George and I, in New York at the UN General Assembly, and it was a fantastic reaction there. The Chinese and ASEAN, but mainly our friends from Singapore, they published a statement. It was a fantastic support for us. So let's go together, we don't have to...not to abandon...we are not abandoning them, but without images, the public indignation, the public reaction will decrease of course, and we must not leave that alone. Certainly, today or yesterday, Madame Aung Sang Suu Kyi, she met with the representive of the junta. This is a sort of little progress, but not enough, not enough. But we are, of course, we are talking also and we are going to talk of bilateral relations. The relations between France and Singapore are excellent. Not only because we offer them sorts of projects etc, but politically, and we will start this very good relationship between the Secretaries-General of Foreign Affairs, (who will) come here etc, and I hope that President Sarkozy will visit Singapore in the coming year.

Q: Minister Yeo, you mentioned just now about asking France for help with the Myanmar situation. What kind of help have you asked for?

Minister: Both of us had good discussions with Ibrahim Gambari in the course of the day. The key now is to encourage the process which has begun in Myanmar, and which we believe we will see some improvement before the Summit in Singapore. The important thing is to ensure that the progress continues after the Summit and not just stave off pressure while the TV cameras are whirring away, with nothing happening after that. So it's key that Gambari's mission persists and endures beyond and achieves results. To do that, he must be empowered and he must be clear that there are certain expectations of the international community. We can't go back to the status quo ante, the problems on the ground must be solved, and Myanmar must conform to common human standards. They are part of ASEAN, they are a part of the region, and there are certain requirements consonant with being a part of the regional and the international community of nations. So I appealed to Bernard to understand the perspective as we see it as a neighbour: understanding that it's a difficult problem, it will take time, and the military has got to be a part of the solution. But so must Aung San Suu Kyi be a part of the solution. And we want all parties to be involved so that Myanmar will remain united, it will not become a Yugoslavia, it would not become an Iraq, and that step-by-step, it would move towards democracy and development.

Q: Minister Kouchner said earlier today that he would suggest to Singapore in his meetings today to possibly consider joining the club that imposes sanctions on Myanmar. I was just wondering what your response was to that?

Minister: The regional countries don't believe that sanctions work. The western countries believe that sanctions achieve a symbolic effect. And I respect the moral and the values standpoint of the western countries. It is within their prerogative. But what is important is whatever measures we take should assist Gambari and not make his work more difficult. It should strengthen his hand, not weaken it.

Q: Mr Minister, who do you think would be coming from Myanmar for the ASEAN Summit? And my second question is: on the issue of sanctions, has Singapore taken any steps to cut banking ties with Myanmar companies?

Minister: We expect Prime Minister Thein Sein to attend the meeting. That was the position Myanmar took when he was Acting Prime Minister so I don't expect any change there. And when he was appointed Prime Minister, my Prime Minister congratulated him and looked forward to his coming here. As for bank accounts, the Americans are doing certain things and it is between the banks and the Americans. As for Singapore, we are an international financial centre. Whatever policy we apply to Singapore banks must apply to all banks operating in Singapore and whatever international agreements there are on restrictions or prohibitions, we will abide by them.

Kouchner: We are not in agreement on sanctions. And this is normal. It is easy for us, being so far, to be satisfied with sanctions. And the European Union and my country, France, we are working on new sanctions. But it's already done for the first sanctions: it is impossible for the people, I mean the military people from the junta, to come to France, to have bank accounts, to receive visas etc. Now we are working on a sort of new sanctions on wood, tropical wood, or gems or jewels, etc and of course, we did our best 'en totale'. We did. We forbid them to have new investments, including this Burmese company 'MOG'. So we were clear about ourselves. But I understand the position. Sanctions is not enough. We had to work on that, we did. But we also have to prove to the people that something is going to them, I mean, the population, not the military, not the government of Myanmar. So we are working together, and we will consider this problem as a sort of incentive, not only sanctions.

Q: Speaking of the incentives, did you bring this suggestion of the fund up in your meeting with Gambari?

Kouchner: We are talking about that, and we are looking to reality. We cannot do it alone. So, we'll offer...to follow Gambari's programme, and to be always with Ibrahim Gambari. We'll see. This is a good idea.

Minister: Thank you very much.

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